In regard to this we had much discussion; but it is too long to write. At last I asked the priest, whether he believed that when he takes the host into his mouth, he receives Christ’s body, in flesh and blood, as large as he hung on the tree of the cross? _Priest._ “Yes.” _Claes._ “When you swallow him, where does he go then?” The priest was highly offended. The chief Judge asked me: “Why could you not be satisfied with your first baptism, but had yourself baptized a second time?” _Claes._ “I know of but one baptism.” Eph. 4:5. _Priest._ “Your sponsors well know that you were baptized once; you can ask them.” _Claes._ “Though I had known that I was baptized, yet I now know that it was done without faith; but it is written (Romans 14:23): Whatsoever is not of faith is sin.” _Chief Judge._ “Your sponsors believed.” _Claes._ “I do not know that the apostles baptized any one, unless he himself believed, and confessed his faith. But what did I confess when I was baptized in infancy?” _Priest._ “Ask your sponsors. And what do you think of our father the Pope, and his dominion?” _Claes._ “The Pope, with all his trumpery, and mass, and all that is therein, is good for nothing, bag and baggage. You priests sell masses to the people, by the dozen, by twenties and thirties at a time; they have neither edge nor point; they neither cut nor stab; and yet you promise the people that they are good and effectual--is this not deception? You preach to the people, that one should not drink to excess, and you go about the streets, as drunk as hogs. You preach that one ought not to be covetous; but where is more covetousness than in the priests and monks? You preach that one ought not to be idle; but where is more idleness than among you? You will rather tramp from door to door with a bag or basket, than work, as may be seen.” The priest was angry, rose, and said: “This is the first thing you teach each other, to reveal the failings of your neighbor.” _Claes._ “Why should we not apply the knowledge Christ has given us, when he says that the tree shall be known by its fruit.” _Priest._ “This is to be spiritually understood;” and he went out of the room.
The chief Judge asked me whether I would renounce my second baptism, and all that I had said. I replied: “No, my lords, I will in no wise deny that which was administered to me in the name of the Lord.” Hearing this, the chief Judge arose. Then they rose and began to go out. I then thanked them, that they had been molested with me. The chief Judge turned around, and asked me again, whether I would renounce; or I should see what should result to me from it. Then my heart was enkindled to tell him and the other Judges, that they should take heed what they were doing, and I said: “My lords, renounce I will in no wise, and what will result to me from it, according to the imperial mandate, I well know; but there are two mandates, the one from the supreme King, the other from the mortal Emperor, and these two run counter to each other; the one says that both are to be let grow, the good with the bad; the other that the tares are to be rooted up. Therefore, my lords, I pray you, to warn the other Judges, that they consider what is the best; for you have not received the sword, to punish the innocent.” I told them a great deal, as the Lord gave me utterance. He stood there, with his cap in his hand, as did also the other Judge, and the jailer, and they kept very silent. Finally they prayed God, that he would grant me my greatest happiness, and went away.